I posted this in Hot Springs Eternal tribe but I think more people will see it and find it useful here.
I'm sure many people are aware of the problems at this hot spring but I thought I would share my story from this Saturday (3/29/08). A friend and I were at Terwilliger (recently the kiosk at the trailhead was burned down), and heard there was a cop with a dog in the parking lot. We figured it was because of the kiosk but it turns out they were there to examine the cars and search them if the dog smelled anything. We were warned about this on our walk down by someone who was searched but nothing was found.
As soon as I reached the parking lot the cops new my name what car was mine and were going to search it no matter what. I was able to get them not to search it by giving away a tin with herb and my pipe. I ended up getting a $525 dollar ticket and they let me go on my way. And they were still waiting for one car that had a "hit" by the dog. All in all it was a lot better than what could have happened if they searched the car. They told me that it is common practice to bring a drug dog to that parking lot and smell the cars. The cops also said they don't care about small amounts (less than pound) and that is why I only got a ticket. If this is true then I question there reasoning for coming to that parking lot because they would only catch users there.
I wanted to warn all out there to be careful at this particular hot spring. I'm sure many people know about the vandelism probablems but federal police targeting herb users is new to me. I would never leave anything in the car because they never even tried to search my person. Good luck to all that visit this spring because I don't think I'll be returning for a long time.
I'm sure many people are aware of the problems at this hot spring but I thought I would share my story from this Saturday (3/29/08). A friend and I were at Terwilliger (recently the kiosk at the trailhead was burned down), and heard there was a cop with a dog in the parking lot. We figured it was because of the kiosk but it turns out they were there to examine the cars and search them if the dog smelled anything. We were warned about this on our walk down by someone who was searched but nothing was found.
As soon as I reached the parking lot the cops new my name what car was mine and were going to search it no matter what. I was able to get them not to search it by giving away a tin with herb and my pipe. I ended up getting a $525 dollar ticket and they let me go on my way. And they were still waiting for one car that had a "hit" by the dog. All in all it was a lot better than what could have happened if they searched the car. They told me that it is common practice to bring a drug dog to that parking lot and smell the cars. The cops also said they don't care about small amounts (less than pound) and that is why I only got a ticket. If this is true then I question there reasoning for coming to that parking lot because they would only catch users there.
I wanted to warn all out there to be careful at this particular hot spring. I'm sure many people know about the vandelism probablems but federal police targeting herb users is new to me. I would never leave anything in the car because they never even tried to search my person. Good luck to all that visit this spring because I don't think I'll be returning for a long time.
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Re: Police at Couger (Terwilliger) Hot Springs
Sun, April 13, 2008 - 7:08 PMIt's so sad
That place used to be so good
I walked in on a medicine ceremony near there is 1996
off the paths and met so many people
It wasn't perfect, but you could hang out there for a while and get a ride anywhere in the country
of course the closer you were going the quicker you could get a ride
I miss it so much
is Jacob still around up there, the guy who knows the meanings of everyone's name? -
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Re: Police at Couger (Terwilliger) Hot Springs
Tue, April 15, 2008 - 10:52 AMI never met Jacob but the place is very different than it was in 1996. A lot more people and problems associated. I think the whole police thing began in 97 or 98 after the Oregon Rainbow Gathering, at least that is what I have heard. -
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Re: Police at Couger (Terwilliger) Hot Springs
Wed, May 7, 2008 - 5:45 AMI have been going to Cougar since I was 7- - -I am 34 now and live in Oakland. Very sad to hear of new problems. However, Cougar seems to go through ups and downs and the darkest moment was when the FS set out to Dynamite the springs. it will get better especially if good people like you are not scared away---
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Re: Police at Couger (Terwilliger) Hot Springs
Sat, May 10, 2008 - 7:58 PMThis sounds like a shakedown scheme to me.
I seriously doubt that a dog can reliably smell a small quantity of pot in a locked car over all the other car smells. How do you know someone else didn't smoke next to your car while you were hiking. Or got wasted then peeed 45 minutes later next to your car? Not to mention that cops have been know to lie and to plant evidence - especially when their's a lot of cash involved.
Look at it this way. They know a some number of visitors will have a joint or two or a pipe. Most people don't know that they can refuse a warrantless search. Think of how many thousands of $$$$$$ they can bring in to their departmental budget each month. And, where are those papers documenting that Fido can actually smell anything? Bet they can't produce them on the spot.
Anyone contacted the Congressperson for this district (hopefully in writing), or their Senators? Bet they don't know this little scheme is going on. -
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Re: Police at Couger (Terwilliger) Hot Springs
Sun, May 11, 2008 - 10:23 AMThe dogs can smell the aroma of pot that you had in your car days before...there is no way of hiding it from them. I have a friend that goes to Amsterdam every year, when he get back into the states the dogs go right to the pocket in his backpack where he had stored his baggie of pot when in Amsterdam...even tho it is empty and many hours had passed. If you have anything in your car they will find it.
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Unsu...
Re: Police at Couger (Terwilliger) Hot Springs
Sun, May 11, 2008 - 11:17 AM> And, where are those papers documenting that Fido can actually smell anything?<
Right here in my pocket, Bill, now hand over the goods! :-) -
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Re: Police at Couger (Terwilliger) Hot Springs
Mon, May 12, 2008 - 10:24 AMI'm glad that people are as outraged as I was, but let it be know that I did refuse a warentless search and they informed me that they legally had a warent because of the dog and could produce it for me, that is when I began to cooporate. There are a lot of strange things to this story, they were waiting for three cars. One before me did let them search the car because he had such a small amount and they did not find it, if I did not cooporate it would have been worse, that is why I began to cooperate once it was clear they had a warent. I imagine that the whole thing has to do with $$$$ and these cops just needed to fill a quota or something.
Also I will try not to be scared away but from now on its just one joint and nothing in the car! Also, I did just drive right past it two days ago when I went to see if bigalow was warm (still cold) and did not stop because of the bad taste in my mouth from this experience.
Peace and love to all! -
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Re: Police at Couger (Terwilliger) Hot Springs
Mon, May 12, 2008 - 4:47 PMGreat... go to court with the dog, get the warrant. Sounds like a bunch of BS to me.
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Re: Police at Couger (Terwilliger) Hot Springs
Sun, May 18, 2008 - 4:55 PM
> legally had a warent because of the dog
Huh? Did they show it to you? So they drove all the way into town while you were away - or did they have a so-called "John Doe" warrant?
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Re: Police at Couger (Terwilliger) Hot Springs
Mon, May 19, 2008 - 9:45 AMSearch warrant? Welcome to post 9/11 'merica! The patriot act changed the rules...Police can secretly enter your home when you are gone, do a search, and never tell you about it. Once their dog detects an "illegal" substance in your car you are screwed, they have probable cause to search, you are guilty until proven innocent, the search is your opportunity to prove your innocence...and of course if you dont comply you must be hiding something?
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Re: Police at Couger (Terwilliger) Hot Springs
Mon, May 19, 2008 - 9:48 AMThey had a so called "John Doe" warrant that allowed them to search whatever cars the drug dog has a reaction too, and they did offer to pull it out if I was unwilling to cooperate and let them into my car. So the warrent was for the car and nothing else, but I did not actually ask to see the warent. Around that part of the story is when I began to cooperate so that they would not search the car completely. -
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Re: Police at Couger (Terwilliger) Hot Springs
Fri, May 23, 2008 - 7:11 PMToo bad you didn't see it. I was curious as to how old it was - last week? Last month?
Ploy (if you have the time and are willing to put up with a certain amount of lies and bullshit): You have a right to have an attorney present at the search. They probably won't let you leave to get one, but you're cooperating. There shift will be over sooner or later - they either have to let you get one somehow or give up. If they ignore that request and search anyway, they ball will be in your court (pun intended).
As I said before, sounds like a shakedown. Persue appropriately
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